Soooo Quiet in Here

[14Steve14]

I have just read a recent post on the Opencart forum, just out of curiosity as it came up in a search, about it being quiet on that forum, and they seem to be saying something similar as I see often in these forums. Lack of users, loss of supporters and developers as they are all moving to other software, and the lack of awareness from new users that there are addon costs to pay to get the store that they want. they also say that lots of users are moving across to Shopify and Big commerce as they are an all in one package.

So being quiet is also hitting some of the larger software systems.

[burt]

I have just read a recent post on the Opencart forum, just out of curiosity as it came up in a search, about it being quiet on that forum, and they seem to be saying something similar as I see often in these forums. Lack of users, loss of supporters and developers as they are all moving to other software, and the lack of awareness from new users that there are addon costs to pay to get the store that they want. they also say that lots of users are moving across to Shopify and Big commerce as they are an all in one package.

So being quiet is also hitting some of the larger software systems.

All of the Open Source carts (and some of the paid for carts) say the same. The landscape has changed over the last decade.

We have to find ways to (a) modernise, (b) offer things/ways that the likes of Shopify can't, and (c) not compete on price/feature parity with other OS carts. I believe we have been working towards answers here;
(a) is a given, we have to modernise the software & the ecosphere as best we can
(b) we can go from idea to prototype in a day - shopify and bigcommerce simply can't as they have structures in place for QA, testing, thinktank and more
(c) the move to core/addons standing side by side "Your Phoenix" and the move away from "free" to "value it".

Having said all that, that Shopify make it so easy is appealing. But it goes against the very essence of what Phoenix has always been.

Could Phoenix be an "in the cloud" thing for £$99 or whatever a month? Of course it could - that was being done back in 2002 using osCommerce, and was even featured in a national newspaper for being innovative & bringing ecommerce to anyone for £30 a month. Is that where Phoenix should be? Locking users up for £$xx per month, owning users data, owning users customers, allowing addons only if they meet stringent conditions...

Discuss...

[Kofod95]

Is that where Phoenix should be? Locking users up for £$xx per month, owning users data, owning users customers, allowing addons only if they meet stringent conditions...

No.
This would make Phoenix "not-Phoenix". If someone wants to use Phoenix that way, they can, but it isn't what Phoenix should be.

Open source and not commercialised is difficult. Not less so in a time where things like the EU makes it more and more difficult with ridicilous rules hitting small companies hard and resulting in the survival of big brands only. But Phoenix rose from the ashes of OSC - it exists to enable everyone willing to take that route to have their own shop. Not something they rent. Not something they borrow. Not something that limits their possibilities. But something that does the heavy lifting for them, and enables them to be limited by imagination only. Something each shop-owner owns themselves.

Of course, we could use more people doing some lifting. But we want them to lift Phoenix, and not something else. In my opinion, Phoenix must stay true to what it is!

//Daniel

[Mort_Lemur]

I did a bit more AI assisted googling with the question: Where do potential users of Phoenix cart start their search?

The answer was:

They usually start with a problem or a recommendation, before they know the name of a platform. There is no single starting point, but these are the places I would watch for Phoenix:

- It then listed all the usual methods of searching

However, all the searches I have done seem to place one thing that could be done to improve the visibility of Phoenix above the others:

Your route to Phoenix is especially revealing: you searched for a solution to osCommerce 2.3.4 on PHP 5.6, rather than searching for Phoenix Cart by name.

That suggests a practical priority: make Phoenix visible for the questions people ask at the start. A clear, findable page about moving from old osCommerce, backed by your real experience, could reach someone before they have assembled their shortlist. From there, it should take them straight to the migration guidance and live demo.

What it is recommending is a section of the forum, or well documented threads, about moving to phoenix from other platforms, written in a way that would address answers to ALL the questions a potential user may ask when searching for an e-commerce solution.

There was also a lot of weight put on the availability of real live sites for people to view when looking at capabilities - but I know that this is a big no-no for most shop owners.

[burt]

That sounds good. I wonder if it would be better done on places outside of the Phoenix site.

EG; reddit, linkedin, shopowners own site (eg a really cool "our journey in ecommerce" page or something - written by the shopowner in their words).

--

A few months back, advised in another thread to change the forum structure and to put up a "Live Shops" area in the forum,, called "Store Showcase". That could be utilised? There's only been one shopowner who bothered (since it's been new) Alix at Soonline => viewtopic.php?f=44&t=3223 - one taker in several months, on our own turf, kind of makes the case for me: if we can't get shop owners to showcase their site here, where they're already maybe a tiny bit invested, we're unlikely to get much traction building something new to do the same job. Better, probably, to go where the "before they've assembled their shortlist" crowd already are, rather than build another place and hope they find it.

The other two in there are older threads since moved into the new showcase area. Maybe the inference that this is a "no-no" for most is correct.

[Mort_Lemur]

I seem to remember from OSC days that shop owners are reluctant to add their shop link in forums, as they then get googled and potential customers can see all the comments - both good and bad about the store. I think most are afraid as being seen as one man bands using free (although excellent!) software.

[burt]

There's also this; https://phoenixcart.org/showcase.php
which is solely shopowner comments.

Perhaps some addition to that page showing the differences to stock?
Eg, a list of addons per carousel that made it "Your Phoenix" (ie, their phoenix)...
Or even a migration story - I was on on osc but migrated to phoeniix because a/ and b/ and c/ - that could work on the showcase or in the forum (or even, better i think, externally on linkedin, reddit, whereever), or that blog page on shopowners own site. Of course, depends on that "no-no" factor.

--

I'm unsure on the "don't want my business associated with DIY free software" as many many shops have "powered by phoenix" in the Footer area. Maybe the no-no thing is smaller than suggested - maybe it's a "just can't see value in feedback" or "I'm scared of ending up with someone finding something wrong in my site" thing ?

[burt]

Replying to oneself...

reddit, linkedin, shopowners own site (eg a really cool "our journey in ecommerce" page or something - written by the shopowner in their words).

A bit like the concept of Product Anywhere - show your products where your potential customers are already reading...

Tell your Phoenix story where potential shopowners are already reading.

Different level of strategy but more or less the same concept. I like it, but again depends on (a) shopowner having a story, and (b) shopowner putting their neck on the line to tell that story.